Hillary Democrats - Step Away from the Floor!

I've taken the liberty of turning TexasDarlin's diary around so we can all hear how it sounds the other way.  Please know - it's not personal.  This Texan honors her commitment to Democratic ideals and to an amazing Democratic leader, Sen. Hillary Clinton.)

It's projected that Barack Obama will have more delegates than Hillary Clinton.  He's already far ahead, and the gap just continues to grow.  The party is coalescing around him as the presumptive nominee.

Yet some Clinton supporters seem anxious to seize any possible grounds or means to thwart this outcome.  They must have limited imaginations, not realizing how it would outrage half the party to elevate the loser of the nomination process over the clear winner.

Obama Democrats will feel aggrieved if the Superdelegates over-turn our votes.  It's naive to assume that we'd happily jump on the Unity Express to join forces against Republican enemies in November.  We have feelings too, even if they're not convenient to the pro-Clinton narrative.  Millions of Democrats -- whether party faithfuls or new members representing the party's future -- have been deeply turned off by the Clinton campaign's neverending spin.  We're ready to face facts, whether they're convenient for Hillary or not.

As a reminder, Barack Obama has an impressive record as a scholar, activist, and politician.  He has inspired people to support his campaign like nobody in history, including Clinton.  He's helped the disaffected to feel a sense of ownership in our political process and our country.  Millions of them are just like me -- actively campaigning and donating for the first time in our lives.

Now, this takes nothing away from Senator Clinton, as she has also inspired millions of people.  But she also started out with an unimaginable head start as the former First Lady, with all consequent name recognition, political and money connections, and the personal wealth she and Bill built as the former First Couple.  She rode that head start hard, with the theme of inevitability and all.  Now it just seems presumptuous of her to have gone there in the first place.  Ever since she lost that first state, we've heard constant spin about why her losses don't matter, why Obama isn't even adequate... Hell, she even compared him unfavorably to our Republican opponent in her attempt to dominate the nomination fight.

We've also heard a lot from the Clinton campaign about race and gender.  We've heard Ferraro say that racism isn't a barrier the way sexism is - that it's an advantage.  We've heard Clinton's campaign go on about Obama's supposedly weak performance with White voters.  We've heard her jump on the Jeremiah Wright bandwagon.  We've heard Clinton appeal to fellow women directly, and to fellow White voters indirectly, in the ways Obama could never appeal to Black voters or men without being screwed by a double standard.  In the absence of a more flattering explanation for this behavior, millions of people see it as cynical identity politics.  Hard to stomach.

In this context, a floor fight that unseats Obama as the nominee - after he's so far outperformed her - would be unacceptable to everyone who's been a part of his victory.  TexasDarlin and others:  Do you expect his supporters would have an easier time swallowing that than you'd have if Clinton loses?  Do you think we're any less passionate than you?  Do you think we'll stand for your ultimatums based on the sexism Clinton faces, but ignore her advantages of establishment connections, wealth and race?

It's natural for supporters of the losing candidate to feel as though their candidate was robbed - to feel wronged and cheated.  One way to handle that is with threats to take our marbles and go home unless our candidate wins.  But of course, the party can't afford for EITHER candidate's supporters to play that way.  For the party to function, we all have to agree that as a party, we'll compete hard, but then unify harder.

Your difficulty accepting Obama's victory is the very reason this can't go to the floor.  In recognition that this will not be easy for the supporters of the losing candidate, we can't wait that long.  It wouldn't give the party enough time to heal.  And we need that healing, so we can turn to McCain and take him on with everything we've got.

This is not personal against Hillary.  She's a standout.  But she's up against another standout, and like her, he's polling great and proving himself in lots of other ways.  With a presumptive nominee like that, no matter how great Hillary is, a floor fight would be a disservice to the party.

I've never diaried before.  If I mess up some commenting etiquette or something, somebody let me know.  Thx.



Display:


Re: Hillary Democrats - Step Away from the Floor! (2.00 / 3)

Great diary Matt!  Sure its your first?  I know a few on this site that will just read it and want to tear it apart since it doesn't jive with their own personal sense of reality, but it makes sense to me.

And I TOTALLY agree with you that we need time to heal.  A lot more than eight weeks. We need to hit the ground running, the sooner the better.  McSame won't be a pushover although I would much rather be in our position that the Repubs.

Thanks for taking time to diary.  


by Rick in Eugene on Fri May 16, 2008 at 06:25:20 AM EST

Obama's only 100,000 votes ahead (none / 0)

When you count Florida (Obama ran) and Michigan (obama removed HIMSELF)

I hope you realize that.

Not exactly a huge lead in popularity or a 'mandate' either.

More like a shotgun wedding.


Universal healthcare IS a Democratic value
It's been defeated
Obama has the best $PIN that money can buy.
by architek on Fri May 16, 2008 at 06:47:56 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama's only 100,000 votes ahead (2.00 / 2)

I hope you realize counting Michigan is a shameful and absurd exercise. Try to maintain some dignity, please.


by Fairy Tale on Fri May 16, 2008 at 06:57:56 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama's only 100,000 votes ahead (1.00 / 2)

I hope you realize NOT counting Michigan is a shameful and absurd exercise. Try to maintain some dignity, please.


Until recently I was selling drugs, and now I'm selling Obama T-shirts.
by switching sides on Fri May 16, 2008 at 07:16:01 AM EST
[ Parent ]

It shouldn't be legal (2.00 / 1)

In the last few years Ive seen so many dirty tricks in electioneering.

But I didn't think the Dems would find themselves in this situation.

WHO is doing this and WHY are they so desperate to have Obama win?


Universal healthcare IS a Democratic value
It's been defeated
Obama has the best $PIN that money can buy.
by architek on Fri May 16, 2008 at 07:20:48 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: It shouldn't be legal (2.00 / 1)

You act like these are grave questions with indistinguishable answers.

The who: the rules and bylaws committee

They why: because they violated DNC rules

The who's and why's you should be asking:

The 2nd who: Who signed the pledge to not participate in those primaries?  All the candidates

The 2nd why: Why is one candidate suddenly (although sudden happened in February once she was losing in delegates) trying to renege on that pledge?


by The Distillery on Fri May 16, 2008 at 07:26:17 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Because the other candidate does not want revote (none / 0)

One way or another, those states should be heard.

Its quite possible to do revotes. People have offered to pay for it. The election is quite close (despite the media coronantion)

What gives?

Seriously. I DON'T THINK OBAMA WILL WIN.

What is more important to all of us, at least for me, having a Democrat in the White House is the most important thing. Also, not being bankrupted by healthcare bills (I have three chronic conditions, but increasingly, I'm not what I would expect to be considered 'uninsurable' sick - knock on wood - because for a while I thought I was - and the drugs I take are not high tech, so they SHOULD NOT BE EXPENSIVE. But I have done research on this and its clear to me that if I have to go and buy insurance as an individual, I wont be able to get it and I could rapidly lose everything I have if I do get really sick again. Also because of the cost of the drugs I take, which are ridiculously overpriced. THEY HAVE TRIPLED IN PRICE IN THE LAST FEW YEARS.) THERE ARE MILLIONS OF PEOPLE IN THIS SITUATION AND WE CAN'T WAIT INDEFINITELY TO HAVE THIS DEALT WITH.

Hillary understands that. Obama DOESN'T - AT ALL. He pretends to, but he doesn't.


Universal healthcare IS a Democratic value
It's been defeated
Obama has the best $PIN that money can buy.
by architek on Fri May 16, 2008 at 07:38:28 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Because the other candidate does not want revo (2.00 / 2)

OMG, the revotes were axed by the state legislatures.  Obama wouldn't support the MI revote as it stood because it did not allow for those who voted in the Republican primary to vote in the Democratic primary.  (Many voted in that primary because they knew their vote would not count in the Democratic primary.)  However, that is not why the revote failed to pass in the legislature anyway.  Stop revisioning history.

And spare me your sob story.  I don't have healthcare right now.  I pray that by the time I do have it again, I don't have something that can be given the argument that a prudent person would have sought help and therefore it's not covered.  Obama's mother died of ovarian cancer.  Her struggles with maintaining her healthcare for her cancer despite changing jobs are well documented in Obama's books, and he has made healthcare a priority since he took office in the 90's.  Spare me your crap.

P.S.  Your sig line made me laugh.  Out loud.  Very funny.


by The Distillery on Fri May 16, 2008 at 07:50:09 AM EST
[ Parent ]

you should be asking: (2.00 / 1)

What YOU should be asking yourself is how you managed to end up on the side that is demanding that legally cast votes don't count.

YOU should be asking yourself how in the hell did you ever end up supporting the next Bushite disenfranchiser?

Good luck with allll that.


Until recently I was selling drugs, and now I'm selling Obama T-shirts.
by switching sides on Fri May 16, 2008 at 08:18:32 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: you should be asking: (none / 0)

You know, using that newspaper quote about "selling drugs" tends to undermine belief that you're an objective observer.  

Maybe you're just a wee bit biased.


by TL on Fri May 16, 2008 at 09:45:29 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: you should be asking: (none / 0)

I think it's reasonable to play by the rules, where the FL and MI delegations will be seated at 50%.  Obviously both contests were heavily compromised.  

MI is a little absurd, in that we're having to choose a number of delegates that seems reasonable to represent Obama's support there, while also reflecting the results of the deeply compromised election.  If this were going to determine the winner, I don't know how we could possibly resolve that in a way that anyone could accept.  I think a revote would be the only way.

Since this won't make or break anyone's campaign, I'm open to accepting the election results at 50%, 100%, or somewhere in between.  Both states have already paid a big penalty anyways: They have not had real influence on the process, even if we now decide to seat some or all of their delegates.  

What a shame!  Let's not make this kind of mess again with our primaries.


McCain: because not everyone's ready to say goodbye to W yet!
by Matt Smith on Fri May 16, 2008 at 11:48:36 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama's only 100,000 votes ahead (none / 0)

Michigan?

Evidently, Architek prefers the Soviet Union circa 1950's model of voting.....

Only the candidate you approve of is on the ballot?

NO ONE but Clinton supports thinks giving Obama ZERO votes out of a state he now leads in the polls is anything but sour grapes and delusion.


"No reason to get excited," the thief, he kindly spoke, "There are many here among us who feel that life is but a joke....
by WashStateBlue on Fri May 16, 2008 at 09:01:16 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Can you explain... (none / 0)

..why Hillary stated that "the votes in Michigan would not count" and why her concern for the "disenfranchished voters" did not appear until she was behind in delegates?

That is why she appears ridiculous when she now makes this claims.  It is obvious that the driving force is just getting herself elected.


"You might well think that. I couldn't possibly comment"
by xenontab on Fri May 16, 2008 at 09:42:15 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama's only 100,000 votes ahead (none / 0)

Hello!  You prob won't be surprised to hear I disagree with you.

This is a contest for delegates.  We used to hear that from Clinton herself, until that metric didn't favor her as she expected.  And in terms of the pledged delegates chosen directly by the people, Clinton has lost that contest significantly.

If this were a contest for the popular vote, I imagine Obama would have run a different campaign.  And given how well he's played the game we're actually playing, I daresay he might have won that one too.  

As it is, he played for delegates.  He was strategic.  That's not a bad quality in a president.


McCain: because not everyone's ready to say goodbye to W yet!
by Matt Smith on Fri May 16, 2008 at 11:33:54 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Hillary Democrats - Step Away from the Floor! (2.00 / 2)

I like this diary. I'm afraid at this point that a fight at the convention floor and Clinton walking away with a win would be cast by the media as "stealing" the nomination, and 2 months isn't long enough for a party to get their shit together for healing.

It would end up in a Hillary loss.

No matter how much you disagree with it being "stealing", and I have my thoughts on that, it would be told as such and the narrative would look terrible for our party. AS much as the Hill-lover I am inside, I want us to win in November too, and honestly, I think that Hillary winning at the convention, followed by massive party strife and a loss in November, might effectively kill her political career.

I know that sounds awfully pessimistic, and I know there is party strife as it is, but this would be a massive narrative, one that would murder us in the media. This isn't the old days where nominees were decided via the convention.

I love Hillary, but I have to stand up here and say good point. Obama supporters would have just as valid, if not a more valid cause to say "we were robbed" if Clinton wins at the convention. So we'd basically be in the same position we are now, except 60 or so days from the general election and with the media killing us on a daily  basis because of the nomination.

Obama supporters are just as devoted to Barack as Hillary supporters are to Hill, and I think the mistake made by both sides is the inability for some to see that. If we could all see how much we love the people we are supporting, I think it would go miles for party unity because being able to appreciate someone's pain in the loss of a Presidential canidiate would help in trying to fix things and get people back on board the ticket.

Thanks for the diary.
-Rec'd.


Hillary supporter for Barack Obama in 2008
by zcflint05 on Fri May 16, 2008 at 06:28:01 AM EST

Re: Hillary Democrats - Step Away from the Floor! (2.00 / 2)

Have ye some phantom mojo.


Capitalization is the difference between "I had to help my uncle Jack off a horse..." and "I had to help my uncle jack off a horse..."
by igottheblues on Fri May 16, 2008 at 06:44:52 AM EST
[ Parent ]

MANY candidates have been decided at conventions. (none / 0)

So stop the whining.


Universal healthcare IS a Democratic value
It's been defeated
Obama has the best $PIN that money can buy.
by architek on Fri May 16, 2008 at 07:21:40 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: MANY candidates have been decided at conventio (2.00 / 1)

Name one who won the general election.


by The Distillery on Fri May 16, 2008 at 07:27:56 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: MANY candidates have been (none / 0)

Yes.  

We had a grand old time in 1980, after Kennedy took Carter to the convention.  No scars caused by that fight.

Not to mention - what's the point?  Your candidate seems to have figured out that it's over - she's defending Obama now, and freeing up Jamie Rubin to write a piece doing the same in the Washington Post.  

This is in keeping, by the way, with a major talking point of the Clinton campaign - the super delegates are free to exercise their independent judgment.  Well, they're exercising it every day.  The tribe has spoken.


by TL on Fri May 16, 2008 at 09:49:29 AM EST
[ Parent ]

solid... (2.00 / 1)

Have a Phantom rec.


Capitalization is the difference between "I had to help my uncle Jack off a horse..." and "I had to help my uncle jack off a horse..."
by igottheblues on Fri May 16, 2008 at 06:44:26 AM EST

Re: Hillary Democrats - Step Away from the Floor! (none / 0)

An interesting perspective...and one worthy of discussion.

Texas and Alegre have not discuessed what would actually happen if Obama was denied the nomination after a floor fight, despite winning a clear majority of states, votes (by any RATIONAL measure), and delegates.

Perhaps they choose not to discuss this because, deep down, they know that a floor fight is simply not going to happen. Hillary is out on June 3rd or shortly thereafter...the rest is just wasteful blustering by a bunch of sack-happy bloggers.


by NYMinute on Fri May 16, 2008 at 08:32:31 AM EST

The only popular vote that matters (none / 0)

is what each SD INFORMALLY decides matters to him or her when they make their choice.  There is no OFFICIAL popular vote count.  We can debate all day about which popular vote should be used, but it doesn't matter because it's not officially part of the nomination process.

I've not heard a single neutral SD suggest that they will consider the MI vote from January in their thought process, but I wish you luck as you wait to see the SD votes come in.  Have you heard anyone say they would (someone not already committed to Clinton)?


by sasatlanta on Fri May 16, 2008 at 10:06:03 AM EST


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